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Ireland's political and cultural magazine
— December 2009 - January 2010
Interview
,
m i c h a e l s m i t h
lunchtime in Liffey Valley and
I am meeting Claire Tully, Ireland’s only Page
model. She enters the “Arc” bar – tiny - and
apologises for not wearing make-up. I am not
sure if people recognise her: the transients of
shoppingland keep their thoughts to them-
selves, though I detect occasional celebrity half-
murmurings. We make our way to an upstairs
table. She orders a hot lemon.
Originally from Hartstown near
Blanchardstown, everything was fine for the
young Claire until her family moved to Lucan
when she was ten. In Lucan she was “bul-
lied because I have a relatively strong Dublin
accent”; because she was quite quiet and very
good at school; and because of a maternal
régime that ignominiously forbade such teen-
age norms as the wearing of high heels: her
mother always had a thing about wearing
proper shoes.
She was taunted so much at school and in
her area, including amazingly by adults, that
she couldn’t walk through her estate. This
throws me: she thinks she was an outsider. She
doesn’t really get on with Mammy. She was
always Daddy’s girl. Her mother was non-con-
frontational – little help to Claire - and perhaps
as a reaction she’s not like that, she’s outspoken.
Her parents split when she was twelve and she
didn’t really speak to her father for five years,
despite the fact he was and is “solid as a rock”.
She learnt that it’s important for parents
not to say anything against the other if a rela-
tionship breaks up. She’s sick of people who
have split up, talking about themselves. She
feels that, “you had children and they should
be your life”, though she’s not a goo-gaaing
maternal person.
During our interview she mostly focuses
on her own experience to which she typically
diverts any general or political questions.
When pushed, she is articulate and she is not
deliberately avoiding questions. Still, she does
avoid them.
She regrets the “because I’m worth it”
mentality and thinks there’s been too much
emphasis on materialism. She’s always given
time to the homeless. Her mother wanted
material things from her father, who owned
Tullys’ tiles on Dublin’s Smithfield. He in
turn advised Claire against over-estimating
the importance of money, but she neverthe-
less feels you need it to go places - nothing
remarkable there. When I suggest that the
media portray her as materialistic, (isn’t
that the whole point of her?) she’s slightly
phOTOs: geTTy iMages
taken aback and she wants to know specif-
ics. Eventually she laughs easily... it must
be the car comment. She’s been reported on
several occasions saying if a man is a sponger
or doesn’t have a car at thirty she wouldn’t
want to have a relationship with him. And now
there she is across from me regurgitating what
she said on a horrible TV show I saw recently
(while a female psychologist shook her head,
appalled), with the same pursed face.
The source of her preference is that, because
of her own family background, she envisions
herself eventually at home with her kids pro-
vided for by a man (not let down by a bike-
riding sponger). I’m warming to Claire Tully
who’s genuinely bright and sharp but I can’t
help thinking this might mean she has regres-
sive personal views on the roles of women and
men. Why am I here? Oh yes!
Claire Tully is most famous for her Janus-
like coupling of Page , with a perfect score of
points in her Leaving Cert, a first-class hon-
ours degree in Science from Trinity College and
an offer to pursue a doctorate in Immunology
on HIV in Oxford. When she didn’t get the fund-
ing for Oxford she was short on cash and had
nowhere to live in Dublin. The Sun newspaper
liked what it had seen of her in FHM lads’ maga-
zine. She had appeared there after finding their
top honeys unimpressive; and her boy-
friend, who was reading it, suggested she go for
it. And so she finished up on Page .
In politics, she likes to take the side of the
little person and doesn’t like to see rich people
getting away with things. She is against private
education and not unhappy to be described as
“socialist”. She’s disillusioned with the “corrup-
tion of society by money”. What she’s learned
from knowing people like footballers - ordinary
middle-class people like her - and things she’s
been told, would shock you. I ask her if she
lives her life to reflect this. She says that she’s
frugal (“I drive a Yaris with a dint”) and that
there’s a difference between appearance and
reality. “It’s difficult to know - if people see
the real you - if that will sell”. What could she
mean? Earlier she has noted that she was not
popular in Trinity and can be difficult, though,
somewhat improbably, she puts a lot of it down
to bad luck.
Does she think it’s a man’s world? She can
see both sides. There’s only one immunologist
in Trinity. But she can see employers would
be nervous about women in their thirties who
might get pregnant. “There are obvious differ-
ences between men and women. Men can do
more physical jobs. It’s not fair”. But she’s “not
a feminist”. I go on and on that maybe she could
or should be, but she’s not biting. She admits
she can be quite old-fashioned and notes that
women are designed to be nurturers. Feminism
has a connotation of being anti-man, she feels.
Feminists “wouldn’t agree with the Page job
but they’re not seeing - and sometimes this
comes down to esteem issues - since men look
at other women and that drives women insane.
They don’t realise that the men aren’t saying
they’d rather be with the girl”. She doesn’t
think glamour modeling is objectification of
women for male gratification. She is confident
there is no link between Page and women
being consigned to nurturing, or anything in
particular else. I can see that some of these
male-centred and homebirdish views would
appeal more to most men than most women. I
wonder if her personality would do the same,
but I can’t see it.
She thinks women are more physically
attractive than men, though she’s not sure why
and she stresses she’s not gay. I ask if women
are more attractive at all ages and she thinks
that’s a can of worms. “Men can get better with
age”. Maybe in ten years she’ll have a different
attitude, she suggests. I’m beginning to think
that’s the key to her and I ask if it’s possible
she’ll regret what she’s doing, that she might
later reflect that it was politically dodgy. She
accepts that she’s and naive. She’s not
static. Her opinions and life experiences may
change her. I ask if she’s suspended reflective-
ness. She says that if she thought it was wrong
she wouldn’t do it.
A British survey recorded that a stagger-
ing % of girls would rather be glamour
models than professionals. Jordan and Abbie
Titmuss were seen as role models by more to
-year-old girls than JK Rowling and Germaine
Greer, who was favoured by just four percent.
Claire Tully helps other girls to get into Page
and I wonder if she is not concerned she could
be a figurehead for a trade which is exploitative.
She accepts the risk of exploitation for people
who don’t have their heads screwed on like she
does, but she will give advice about the pitfalls;
and she thinks she can provide a useful serv-
ice to them. But she agrees it’s dangerous that
so many young women have no interest in the
brains of their role models.
She respects the women who’re at the top
of the game in Science more than women at the
top in glamour-modelling. I worry that might
mean she has less respect for herself than she
needs to ensure she has, but she brushes it off.
She misses Science. She wanted to do her PhD
a few years ago but she’s not in the right place
now to do it. She’s waiting to settle down – by
which she means with a boyfriend when she is
in her thirties. She thinks “what I’ve done” will
count against her – if she is googled.
Above all, Claire Tully wants to explain
Science which, she is aware, most people
don’t like…now she’s getting passionate. She
worked in a Lab in Trinity on cellular biology.
Experiments were the bane of her life. She’s fas-
cinated by viruses and ”cell-signalling”. She’s
laughing: the body’s fight with viruses is a cat
and mouse game. Even Maths exam questions
aren’t hard - there are only four things you can
do – add, subtract, divide, multiply”. People
need to have the relevance of science con-
veyed to them. In immunology people don’t
know how difficult it is to get cancer. Doctors
don’t tell people what’s wrong with them. That
annoys her. A lot of things can be described
through Immunology.
She’s working on a TV science documentary
– probably Discovery or Channel – to teach
people about diseases. She wants to use what
she has to her advantage. She says the fact she’s
easy on the eye will keep people’s attention.
For all that, beyond her bubbly personality,
the most attractive things about Claire Tully
is her passion for Science, I reflect, as I head
across the damp car-parks and slip-roads of
retail South Dublin, for the bus home.
www.claire-tully.com, if you must
“the body’s fight
with viruses is a
cat and mouse
game”
phOTOs: geTTy iMages
